good ice/bad ice

[Bryan]

Kpmcd, does your Phonebooth iceman buddy know anything about what makes some ice better for sliding than others? Anyone?

One of the local rinks has particularly bad ice at one end. It looks fine, you can skate and shuffle over it ok, but forget sliding on your pads cause they'll just stick.

At first I thought maybe something was wrong with my pads. I had played 5 times last week, including twice that day. I assumed that it was that they were too wet, since they had no time to dry out. But they slide fine at other rinks, and the other end of the offending ice is fine too. When I talked to the iceman and demonstrated my problem by charging for 10 strides and diving to my knees (I immediately stopped dead with absolutely no slide whatsoever!), he had no idea what could cause it, and maintained there was nothing wrong with the ice.

Since one end of one rink is the only place this is happening, it HAS to be the ice, not my pads. It is so bad that I don't think I'm going to play at this rink anymore, since I have to remain standing at all times!

Anyone have any ideas what this is?

Is one end of the rink wetter than the other? The local rink here has an NHL and an Olympic rink, and the NHL rink is almost ALWAYS in poor condition because the idiots don't maintain the ice well. The NHL side is like a pond, and the puck ROUTINELY gets stuck while people try to carry the puck or pass. One second it'll be flying down the rink and then it'll just STOP DEAD IN ITS TRACKS. It also makes playing goalie harder because it causes the goalie to also stop dead in his tracks.

[Bryan]

It's not really wet. I know what you mean about the puck stopping on wet ice, that's not it. The puck slides fine on this rink. I generally don't have problem sliding on water covered ice either, so it's definitely something else.

[kicksave27]

The softer the ice gets the harder it becomes to slide. This can happen with ice that isn't properly maintained or at the end of a period when it gets snowy. My recomendation is to try to get all the snow out of your crease with your stick, with bad ice scratch up the ice a lot with your skates before you start, and squirt water over your crease.

[TartanBill]

Bryan,
Are you describing your pads adhering to the ice? Or is there no adhesion, but only sliding friction.

Sliding friction without adhesion would imply a roughed up ice surface, although I have never seen a surface so rough that I could not slide!

I can speculate that the ice on that end is very cold and you got surface adhesion to your damp pads. Sort of like your tongue on a very cold popsicle.




[This message has been edited by TartanBill (edited September 20, 1999).]

[Bryan]

It certainly seems more like adhesion than friction. When the ice is freshly flooded it's fine. Once it actually freezes, instant velcro. I'm going to play a scrub game there on Sunday. I'm going to keep a 4 gallon jug of water at the net, and just keep the crease wet to see if that helps. If it doesn't, I'm not playing there anymore. I could end up twisting my knee or back because of it!

[TartanBill]

You know, if you put some salt in that water, you might be able to keep the surface wet.

If the problem is ashesion, then maybe some Armor-All or silicon tent spray on the pads would correct it. No game is worth twisting a knee over.

Good luck

[Bryan]

<You know, if you put some salt in that water, you might be able to keep the surface wet.>

Just so long as it's not HOT water right?

[Bryan]

Armourall worked great! It was just the same as 'normal' until about 10 minutes left in the game, when most of the Armourall was worn off.

I generally do clean the crease of snow as habit. The bad end of this rink definitely has a lot more snow build up than the other, so I'd basically have to spend the whole ice time cleaning and just ignore the puck.

[TartanBill]

Interesting,

My bottle of ArmorAll says that several applications might be necessary the first time. That brand also takes quite some time to dry.

For what its worth, I have also used the ArmorAll All Purpose Auto Cleaner with a soft rag to remove puck marks.

[Bernie]

Pardon me if I'm oversimplifying this, but isn't the temperature of the building the #1, if not 100% factor in determining the quality of the ice?

Bernie

[TartanBill]

Building temperature is a major factor to be sure, but the "bad ice" Bryan is describing is very unusual. I have never encountered it.

I don't know all that much about rink design, but I think the cooling coils under the ice are multipass, i.e. they run the length of the ice and back. I have seen the result of a single loop failure. In this case, an alley up the ice starts to melt.

The only points here are that
1) I have seen far more dramatic variances in ice quality on a single surface.

2) The coil temperature (therefore the ice) is likely be a bit colder where the coolant enters than where it leaves.

[Bryan]

Ah-HAH!!! the 'bad' end is wher all the utility rooms are, and I would assume the cooling plant! It probably is just TOO cold!

I don't think ambient temperature is all that important. I'm sure there's more to it. A cold building with a weak cooling plant in the floor is still going to have slushy ice. Conversely, the Winnipeg arena is extemely warm inside. It's almost unbearable to play in it's so hot. Yet when the Jets played here it was considered one of the best ice surfaces in the NHL. It still is very good ice, and still is HOT in the building.

I think humidity might be more of a factor than temperature. Of course, if it's 120°F outside, THEN the building would be hard to keep cool enough to keep the ice!

[This message has been edited by Bryan (edited September 28, 1999).]

[bashby]

Just a thought, but could the problem not be
below the ice but above it? Maybe the rink has a big industrial sized fan vents blowing on the ice at that end and taking all of the surface moisture away.

[Squealagig]

Ahh but a hot building would be better than a cold one because then the water freezes faster

Sorry I'll go take my wooden spoon somewhere else.

Seriously now maybe it's just something stupid like one end is closer to the main doors and someone keeps leaving them open resulting in bad temperatures/humidity. But I agree with the idea of it being more affected by humidity.