Muscles, strength and other common health stuff....

[royfan33]

I think what we really want to know is how many SV% points will this regimen earn us?

Because honestly, I'll take fried chicken and 90.5 over cottage cheese and 91.2 any day.

[Fade2Black]

Originally Posted by mont

Tuna sandwich. Whole wheat bread, 1 can tuna with tomato and pepper. NO MAYO! CANT EAT A SANDWICH WITHOUT IT - GET USED TO IT! Here's a tip: Instead of feeling like your sandwich is missing tha mayo, get used to alternate ideas - like pepper - or tabasco - or mustard as an example. (For the Tuna sandwich pepper is just fine thanks

I agree with this point. I used to always eat my tuna with mayo, but I've learned to find other ways to flavor my tuna. Things like salsa are great and go a long way.

[efstratios1]

Originally Posted by Fade2Black

I agree with this point. I used to always eat my tuna with mayo, but I've learned to find other ways to flavor my tuna. Things like salsa are great and go a long way.

I go with lemon, but I still feel like I'm eating cat food lol.

[iwantvapors]

Hey Mont, i have read your latest posts and have a couple of questions. Right now i am 6 ft 200-205lbs, and 16yo. I want to turn my excess fat into muscle. I could probably stand to lose 10-15 lbs of fat. Ive been working out for a bit--couple of months, and have just started taking purple k (type of creatine). Im going 3x a week, soon to be 4-5 times. Im going to use your advice for eating (which can be used if wanting to turn fat into muscle, not just add extra muscle right?). Im also going to use pro complex like you suggested. What else can I do to get into shape for summer? Just looking to lose some weight and get tonned/ripped. Other then cardio (how often and how long?) what else would you suggest. One more thing, how often should I workout abs, and which exercises would you recommend to get a 6 pack. Thanks alot.

[blockersave0120]

to stregthen your legs and abs and to enhance your stretching would it be good to do yoga and pilates?????

[Barren]

Nice write-up Mont!

I'm stuck at a plateau and I know it's all because of my diet/eating habits... and my gut knows it too!

[Fade2Black]

Originally Posted by iwantvapors

I want to turn my excess fat into muscle.

Impossible. You will have to lose the fat first, then gain muscle.

Other then cardio (how often and how long?)

Start out doing 30 minutes a session, 3x a week and then increase duration and frequency as needed. Refrain from eating carbohydrates 2 hours before the cardio session. Eating protein directly before is fine.

One more thing, how often should I workout abs

2-3 times a week as isolation exercises. IF you do compound lifts they will get worked during those.

and which exercises would you recommend to get a 6 pack.

Diet and exercise. Abs are made in the kitchen.

[efstratios1]

Originally Posted by Fade2Black

Abs are made in the kitchen.

I want some abs to go please.

Good advice F2B.

[mont]

Originally Posted by iwantvapors

Hey Mont, i have read your latest posts and have a couple of questions. Right now i am 6 ft 200-205lbs, and 16yo. I want to turn my excess fat into muscle. I could probably stand to lose 10-15 lbs of fat. Ive been working out for a bit--couple of months, and have just started taking purple k (type of creatine). Im going 3x a week, soon to be 4-5 times. Im going to use your advice for eating (which can be used if wanting to turn fat into muscle, not just add extra muscle right?). Im also going to use pro complex like you suggested. What else can I do to get into shape for summer? Just looking to lose some weight and get tonned/ripped. Other then cardio (how often and how long?) what else would you suggest. One more thing, how often should I workout abs, and which exercises would you recommend to get a 6 pack. Thanks alot.

Check Fade's comments , we couldnt agree more. You wont ever be able to "turn fat into muscle" but you can lose the fat while growing the muscle at the same time. You can work your abs every day as they recover quicker than any other body part but it isnt necessary. I do it every 2 days, but I also do compound lifting.

Again, this 6 pack thing has been explained quite thoroughly already. If you want to see your abs - you gotta diet as described. If you want strength you can gain this numerous ways - the best among them being situps on a ball, and "cycle" situps simply laying down on a mat. Captains chair is another one. I think one of the few good machines for gaining core strength for goaltending is the classic technogym abs weight machine. This is good training simulation for "popping" yourself back up if down on your side or back as in a real game. But see below very carefully...

Again and again - if you dont get the fat off, you wont ever see those muscles you refer to (6 pack) no matter how much you work on them.

Please describe a life in the day diet for you - be honest, and
when you workout in the gym, what is your general plan once there?

[Connors]

Originally Posted by mont

I received a PM asking more specifics about the dietary aspect for one that has gone off the deep end and how to get on track and keep it. Its such a good question I thought I'd relay it here for all.

>>It should be stated that there is a plethora of info out there. Problem is, without knowing what lies behind the information, it is often difficult to know what is good and what is gobbeldeegook info. I am just a "normal guy" sharing info about my own results and how I get them. I am not a pro or sponsored in any way regarding fitness/supplements etc. so the info I give is real, not sensationalised. After salmonella, I weighed 145lbs, three month later it was ca.185lbs low fat, and no drugs. I have no trouble showing the results either, but I think such photos belong on bodybuilding sites than here on a goalie BB lol <<

First of all it should be clear this discussion is geared towards the individual whom is able to integrate weight training into his daily life together with the "aerobic" aspect one gets from the hockey itself. We all have busy schedules but the weight training is something that only requires less than 1 hour a day every 2 days. Its really a matter of "will" than it is anything else. I have a near 24-7 job, 2 kids, plus hockey so I figure if its manageable by myself, it shouldnt be impossible for others. If the motivation isnt there, neither will the results.

About the stomach area - its all about diet - perhaps 99% . You will show a 6 pack by removing the fat on the muscles there. You will NOT show a 6 pack by having strong stomach muscle with a layer of fat. Actually you might, but they will simply "portrude" through that fat - not your goal. And you CANNOT spot reduce. All the focus on the stomach excerices without a rigid, smart form of diet, means you might as well not even try. (Timbers' comments about the TYPE E person who easily burns fat is true to a degree but not totally applicable to our goal in this case, which is for a lean, but muscular body that is well defined and powerful.) Knowing these facts, one has to first accept some simple but drastic disciplines will be required.

Weight training, and doing it properly - is essential. Thats a post in itself.

But the biggest factor, the key to the "powerful, sculpted body look" is FOOD. I say FOOD instead of diet here so there is no misunderstanding. We are not talking eating less as has been mentioned for. You can eat very little and still have a skinny body with a nice gut - but that's not what we want! So we have to learn to eat - all the time - about 6 times a day - but we must be selective and DISCIPLINED what it is, and ISNT, that we are putting in our bodies.

Here is what you want to not simply reduce, but ELIMINATE from your diet:
(once every 2 weeks is ok, but you probably wont care - see comments later)

1. mayo or anthing like mayo
2. butter
3. white rice, white bread
4. candy of any kind
5. sodas of any kind
6. anything containing ordinary "sugar"
7. fatty meats that have an abundance of "white stuff"
8. fast food - all of it
9. deserts/snacks like potatoe chips etc./ice cream
10. any milk other than skim


Here is what you want to include in your diet on a daily or weekly basis:

0. Lots of water during the day
1. Whey protein/maltodextrin blended shakes - these will have the bonus of satisfying your sweet cravings
2. chicken breast without the skin
3. tuna in water, not oil
4. salmon
5. fruits/vegetables - oranges, broccoli, carrots, and tomatoes beign good choices
6. wheat germ
7. flaxseed oil or mix of omega 3/6/9
8. quality multivitamin(s)
9. vitamin c pill ie. 500mg daily
10. oatmeal
11. lowfat cottage cheese before bedtime

(creatine is an option I use as well but I wont put it on the list as it is not relevant to the topic of the moment)
Eat 6 meals a day from morning to bedtime. Dont overly stuff yourself, but dont ever allow a "hunger feeling" either - you become catabolic which burns fat, but all important muscle as well. You want to keep out the fat and put on the muscle. Dont look at the scales - they mean nothing! Use the mirror! If you exchange 185 pounds of fat for 195lbs of muscle, wouldnt you be happy?

Sound tough? Sound boring? Sound impossible? Well, its called "using food for function" instead of ...anything else! Want results? Convince yourself to get going right away!

Now here's what is interesting. In the beginning it might be pure hell and you will have all the reasons in the world to not stick to it - but you must. You know what? After a few weeks, you might almost puke if you even look at anything on the first list! Once you get going, it's so easy and really fun because you will enjoy seeing the results!

The original PM asked how to stay disciplined and that is surprisingly, an easy question to answer. As long as you get started, the results will come and thus, the discipline will become a challenge that is fun to meet - and keep up. It will be a natural thing to do, no longer a battle with yourself. Let your mirror be your best friend. This advice WORKS and when you see and feel the changes, there is no turning back. DISCIPLINE? RESULTS TAKE CARE OF THAT!

(as mentioned, this diet must be combined with excercise (like hockey) and preferably, weight lifting but that is for later and another post. Point here is, you gotta BEGIN by changing the fuel in the tank from the norm. Its UHYGGELIGT VIGTIGT (critically important!) Get control of this aspect of the 2 part puzzle, and you have every reason in the world to believe you your goals can be achieved.

I just printed this and stuck it on my fridge

Thanks Mont!

[vinny]

awesome post mont

[goalieman48]

Ive followed a plan very similar to that of which Mont posted, the only real difference is that I always do my cardio in the mornings on an empty stomach, so I burn through the fat, instead of intaking other sourses of fuel such as carbohydrates and proteins. Im personaly on a high cardio program, where I do an hour early in the day, and another later at night, all the while properly fueling myself. I do weights/plyo's 3 times a week.

You basicaly summed it up perfectly there Mont, good job.

[Fade2Black]

Originally Posted by goalieman48

Ive followed a plan very similar to that of which Mont posted, the only real difference is that I always do my cardio in the mornings on an empty stomach, so I burn through the fat, instead of intaking other sourses of fuel such as carbohydrates and proteins. Im personaly on a high cardio program, where I do an hour early in the day, and another later at night, all the while properly fueling myself. I do weights/plyo's 3 times a week.

I will refer you to an article written by someone on another board of mine.

Originally Posted by alan aragon

FALSE HOPES FOR FASTED CARDIO

The bandwagon is lead by blind horses

Many trainees pigeonhole weight training as an activity exclusively for building muscle, and cardio exclusively for burning fat. On the contrary, weight training can yield very similar results to cardio of similar intensity when 24-hr energy expenditure and macronutrient oxidation is measured [14]. The obvious advantage of weight training is the higher potential for lean mass and strength gains. In the bodybuilding context, cardio should be viewed as merely an adjunctive training mode to further energy expenditure and cross-complement the adaptations specific to weight training. As far as cardio being absolutely necessary for cardiovascular health, well, that depends upon the overall volume and magnitude of your weight training - another topic for another time.

Chaos theory strikes again

On the surface, it seems logical to separate carbs from cardio if you want a maximal degree of fat oxidation to occur during training. But, there’s the underlying mistake - focusing on stored fuel usage during training instead of focusing on optimally partitioning exogenous fuel for maximal lipolytic effect around the clock. Put another way, it’s a better objective to coincide your carb intake with your day’s thermic peaks, where insulin sensitivity & lean tissue reception to carbs is highest. For some reason, this logic is not easily accepted, nor understood. As we know, human physiology doesn’t always cooperate with logic or popular opinion, so let’s scrutinize the science behind the claims.


LET THE RESEARCH SPEAK

Carbohydrate ingestion during low-intensity exercise reduces fat oxidation

As far as 3 decades back, Ahlborg’s team observed that carb ingestion during low-intensity exercise (25-45% VO2 max) reduced fat oxidation compared to fasted levels [15]. More recently, De Glisezinski’s team observed similar results in trained men at 50% VO2 max [16]. Efforts to determine the mechanism behind this phenomenon have been made. Coyle’s team observed that at 50% VO2 max, carbohydrate availability can directly regulate fat oxidation by coordinating hyperinsulinemia to inhibit long-chain fatty acid transport into mitochondria [17].

Carbohydrate’s effect on fat oxidation during moderate-intensity exercise depends on conditioning level

Civitarese’s team found glucose ingestion during exercise to blunt lipolysis via decreasing the gene expression involved in fat oxidation in untrained men [18]. Wallis’ team saw suppressed fat oxidation in moderately trained men & women when glucose was ingested during exercise [19].

In contrast to the above trials on beginning and intermediate trainees, Coyle’s team repeatedly showed that carb ingestion during moderate-intensity (65-75% VO2 max) does not reduce fat oxidation during the first 120 min of exercise in trained men [20,21]. Interestingly, the intensity margin proximal to where fat oxidation is highest was unaffected by carb ingestion, and remained so for the first 2 hours of exercise.

Horowitz’ team examined the effect of a during-training solution of high-glycemic carbs on moderately trained men undergoing either low intensity exercise (25% VO2 max) or high-moderate intensity (68% VO2 max) [22]. Similar results to Coyle’s work were seen. Subjects completed a 2-hr cycling bout, and ingested the carb solution at 30, 60, and 90 minutes in. In the low-intensity treatment, fat oxidation was not reduced below fasted-state control group’s levels until 80-90 min of exercise. In the 68% group, no difference in fat oxidation was seen whether subjects were fasted or fed throughout the trial.

Further supporting the evidence in favor of fed cardio in trained men, Febbraio’s team investigated the effects of carb ingestion pre & during training in easily one of the best-designed trials on this topic [23]. Subjects exercised for 2 hrs at an intensity level of 63% VO2 max, which is now known as the point of maximal fat oxidation during exercise [1]. Result? Pre & during-training carbs increased performance - and there was no difference in total fat oxidation between the fasted and fed subjects. Despite the elevated insulin levels in the carb-fueled groups, there was no difference in fat availability or fat utilization.

Summing up the research findings

• At low intensities (25-50% VO2 max), carbs during exercise reduce fat oxidation compared to fasted trainees.
• At moderate intensities (63-68% VO2 max) carbs during exercise may reduce fat oxidation in untrained subjects, but do not reduce fat oxidation in trained subjects for at least the first 80-120 minutes of exercise.
• Carbohydrate during exercise spares liver glycogen, which is among the most critical factors for anticatabolism during hypocaloric & other conditions of metabolic stress. This protective hepatic effect is absent in fasted cardio.
• At the established intensity level of peak fat oxidation (~63% VO2 max), carbohydrate increases performance without any suppression of fat oxidation in trained subjects.

Originally Posted by alan aragon

REFERENCES

1. Achten J, Jeukendrup AE. Relation between plasma lactate concentration and fat oxidation rates over a wide range of exercise intensities. Int J Sports Med. 2004 Jan;25(1):32-7.
2. Thompson DL, et al. Substrate use during and following moderate- and low-intensity exercise: implications for weight control. Eur J Appl Physiol Occup Physiol. 1998 Jun;78(1):43-9.
3. Phelain JF, et al. Postexercise energy expenditure and substrate oxidation in young women resulting from exercise bouts of different intensity.J Am Coll Nutr. 1997 Apr;16(2):140-6.
4. Lee YS. Et al. The effects of various intensities and durations of exercise with and without glucose in milk ingestion on postexercise oxygen consumption. J Sports Med Phys Fitness. 1999 Dec;39(4):341-7.
5. Melanson EL, et al. Effect of exercise intensity on 24-h energy expenditure and nutrient oxidation. J Appl Physiol. 2002 Mar;92(3):1045-52.
6. Saris WH, Schrauwen P. Substrate oxidation differences between high- and low-intensity exercise are compensated over 24 hours in obese men.
7. Grediagin A, et al. Exercise intensity does not effect body composition change in untrained, moderately overfat women. J Am Diet Assoc. 1995 Jun;95(6):661-5.
8. Mougios V, et al. Does the intensity of an exercise programme modulate body composition changes? Int J Sports Med. 2006 Mar;27(3):178-81.
9. Okura T, et al. Effects of exercise intensity on physical fitness and risk factors for coronary heart disease. Obes Res. 2003 Sep;11(9):1131-9.
10. Tremblay, et al. Impact of exercise intensity on body fatness and skeletal muscle metabolism. Metabolism. 1994 Jul;43(7):814-8.
11. Yoshioka M, et al. Impact of high-intensity exercise on energy expenditure, lipid oxidation and body fatness. Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord. 2001 Mar;25(3):332-9.
12. Broeder CE, et al. The effects of either high-intensity resistance or endurance training on resting metabolic rate. Am J Clin Nutr. 1992 Apr;55(4):802-10.
13. Gutin B, et al. Effects of exercise intensity on cardiovascular fitness, total body composition, and visceral adiposity of obese adolescents. Am J Clin Nutr. 2002 May;75(5):818-26.
14. Melanson EL, et al. Effect of exercise intensity on 24-h energy expenditure and nutrient oxidation.
15. Ahlborg, G., and P. Felig. Influence of glucose ingestion on fuel-hormone response during prolonged exercise. J. Appl. Physiol. 1976;41:683-688.
16. De Glisezinski I, et al. Effect of carbohydrate ingestion on adipose tissue lipolysis during long-lasting exercise in trained men. J Appl Physiol. 1998 May;84(5):1627-32.
17. Coyle EF, et al. Fatty acid oxidation is directly regulated by carbohydrate metabolism during exercise. Am J Physiol. 1997 Aug;273(2 Pt 1):E268-75.
18. Civitarese AE, et al. Glucose ingestion during exercise blunts exercise-induced gene expression of skeletal muscle fat oxidative genes. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab. 2005 Dec;289(6):E1023-9.
19. Wallis GA, et al. Metabolic response to carbohydrate ingestion during exercise in males and females. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab. 2006 Apr;290(4):E708-15.
20. Coyle, et al. Muscle glycogen utilization during prolonged strenuous exercise when fed carbohydrate. J. Appl. Physiol. 1986;6:165-172.
21. Coyle, et al.. Carbohydrates during prolonged strenuous exercise can delay fatigue. J. Appl. Physiol. 59: 429-433, 1983.
22. Horowitz JF, et al. Substrate metabolism when subjects are fed carbohydrate during exercise. Am J Physiol. 1999 May;276(5 Pt 1):E828-35.
23. Febbraio MA, et al. Effects of carbohydrate ingestion before and during exercise on glucose kinetics and exercise performance. J Appl Physiol. 2000 Dec;89(6):2220-6.

Note, this is not the full article nor am I taking credit for it. If it is requested I can and will post it in it's entirety.

[D Beaupre]

Thanks for taking the time to write all that out, Mont; you're an inspiration.

[guest1]

This thread should be sticky'd in the Dr. Forum.

It's good.