Racism in Dallas

[TIMMAAYY]

"I was born a poor black man."

[elite]

Announcer: Ladies and Gentleman Mr. Robert Goulet.

Robert Goulet: Hello I'm Robert Goulet Da da de da da do. I know one thing we can agree on when a professional gets his mitts on a song that's when it really takes off. Da da de da da do ba dob a do. That's why I've gone out and done the music world a frickin' service, and cut this compact disc. It's called The Coconut Bangers Ball: It's A Rap. Ha Ha Ha A little inside I know. Anyway what you get is one full hour of rip roarin' rap music. Not by some dubious ruffians without the chops, but by a professionally trained voice man. No musical accompaniment. It's just me out there. Watch what I do with this little ditty from Sisqo called the "Thong Song."

(singing "Thong Song" by Sisqo)

"Oh girl that dress is so scandolous,
And you know another Nigga couldn't handle it.
You see dumps like a truck, truck, truck
Not like a what, what, what
Baby move you butt,butt,butt
I think I'll sing it again
Sha bang, sha bop,bop bop.
Thong Song"

Something like that. Hey you wouldn't let a clown fix a leak in the john. So why do you let these hooligans tear down the biz. Yeah!!!!! I don't care if he is mister Notorious big. Can he croon.

(singing "Poppa" by Notorious B.I.G.)

"Poppa, I like it when you call me Big Poppa
Throw your hands in the air if you think your a playa
Poppa, I love it when you call me Big Poppa
To the honeys makin' money playin' niggaz just like dummies
Poppa"

You get the idea. We call it Coconut Bangers Ball: It's A Rap. It's Snoopy, Dre, Biggie, Puff Man, Cooooooooolio, the whole bunch.

(singing Who Let The Dogs Out by Baha Men)

"Who let the dogs out,
Who let those dogs out,
Who let those little muts gooooooooooo!
Yeah! Goulet!"

Well I gotta a gig to make, but do yourself a big favor alright and go out and ( Big Horn walks into scene) hold on lookee here. It's a big horn. Well! (grabs bowl of food) That's why I come up here. Look at you. You're hungry. You don't even blink do you . Quick staring contest me and you Now! (staring contest begins, Goulet blinks) You win, you always do. That's why I come up here.

(singing)

Nature! Goulet!

Anyway check out the CD you'll just love it. Or my name isn't Robert Goulet.

Announcer: The Coconut Bangers Ball: It's A Rap in stores now.

[EvilPepe]

Originally Posted by Declyn

you know... thats the thing that drives me a bit crazy...

there are so many organizations that are specifically black this or black that or 'instert alleged minorty status name here*' that all seem to an OK thing to do.

but if i were to go start a Caucasian American Awareness Society or C.A.W.S. and i started to promote it to Caucasians and asked them to join the C.A.W.S. ... i would be strung up!

i would be considered a racist! or a white eliteist... any number hugely negative things.

but if i did the same exact thing and had it focus on a 'minority*' group i would be considered a humanitarian!

the * next to minority refers to the fact that im white... and honestly i am so not the majority as far as race population goes.

not sure what the rest of the country is like but here in Texas it looks like this:

Texas Politics - Racial and Ethnic Population Trends in Texas, 1850-2000

all frustration aside... i dont give a rats ass what race some one is. i judge people based on their actions.

Oh, look, the "Other" category again.

So, lets say for arguments sake that Texas is now comprised of 40% white, "non-Hispanics". The other sixty percent is not comprised of one individual group, but multiple different groups. Each one of those is a "minority group" because they are in the minority. The "white, non-Hispanic" group is still the majority. Not to mention the wealth and political power is extremely disproportional, giving said group the "majority" by another definition (so even if/when the "Hispanic" population passes the "white, non-Hispanic population, if it hasn't already, I'd still say the "majority" term applies).

Groups like "C.A.W.S"* don't exist because it isn't politically correct. They shouldn't exist because they don't need to. Why does "the majority" need a special group trying to get special privileges for "it's people" when those people have traditionally always had those privileges?

*It is interesting that "Caucasian" is still used as it isn't considered a scientific classification. It's use is based on a theory of the origins of many European people's and the origin of some European language. It doesn't make sense to me the same way using the term "African-American" as a term for all people with darker skin doesn't make sense to me.

[Crease_Flounder]

Originally Posted by EvilPepe

Oh, look, the "Other" category again.
Groups like "C.A.W.S"* don't exist because it isn't politically correct. They shouldn't exist because they don't need to. Why does "the majority" need a special group trying to get special privileges for "it's people" when those people have traditionally always had those privileges?

I agree with you on the first point, but not on the second. To me, it is a matter of representation. In today's political world, the squeekiest wheel gets the grease and most people discern priveleges and freedoms as "rights" (ie: gay rights, right to health care, etc....) As an American, I would love for there to be a politically-acceptable group to counter racially-motivated infringements on MY rights, priveleges, and freedoms, from groups like KARE and LULAC. Just because you're in a racial majority doesn't mean that you should not be represented politically or that you should be denied advocacy. If it's "fair" to have a representative organization for other ethnicities to lobby for their constituents, why should you be excluded just because you're in the majority?

CF

[Roymond]

Wow...

This world is becoming too ridiculously PC.

Whatever happened to do the days of "Sticks and stones will break my bones but words will never hurt me."

[Sparkles]

You seriously believe that?

Apparently you've never heard of defamation. Words are a pretty big deal.

[EvilPepe]

Originally Posted by Crease_Flounder

I agree with you on the first point, but not on the second. To me, it is a matter of representation. In today's political world, the squeekiest wheel gets the grease and most people discern priveleges and freedoms as "rights" (ie: gay rights, right to health care, etc....) As an American, I would love for there to be a politically-acceptable group to counter racially-motivated infringements on MY rights, priveleges, and freedoms, from groups like KARE and LULAC. Just because you're in a racial majority doesn't mean that you should not be represented politically or that you should be denied advocacy. If it's "fair" to have a representative organization for other ethnicities to lobby for their constituents, why should you be excluded just because you're in the majority?

CF

Good point, and I agree to an extent. I probably shouldn't have used the term "special privilege". My point was more that the "majority" doesn't have to worry about racial issues as a minority group would, so their focus and grouping would be along different lines - sexuality, gender, age, class, profession, ect.

[EvilPepe]

Originally Posted by Roymond

Wow...

This world is becoming too ridiculously PC.

Whatever happened to do the days of "Sticks and stones will break my bones but words will drive you insane."

Corrected for ya.

[Declyn]

Originally Posted by EvilPepe

Good point, and I agree to an extent. I probably shouldn't have used the term "special privilege". My point was more that the "majority" doesn't have to worry about racial issues as a minority group would, so their focus and grouping would be along different lines - sexuality, gender, age, class, profession, ect.

in a way being male and white is like one of the worst things ever... i could not get one red cent in the financial aid department when i was trying to go to college.

but a buddy of mine whose father had the same job as my dad and about the same years of service at work as my dad, and (his mom worked where mine did not) was able to get a full ride. he was 'mixed' father was black, mother was white.

i asked if his ride was grades based and he told me no his grades were border line at best. he totally agreed it was because he was listed as black on the application forms.

several of my other friends are american indian... they got full rides, although they had to go to either oklahoma or kansas to get it. according to them as long as you could prove you are 1/8th american indian they get free medical care, and free schooling.

none of my friends nor their families had been oppressed none of them came from poor families. we were all middle-ish class families.

all of us were about the same grade wise. yet i had to take out tons of loans, my dad took out loans, and i worked 30 hours a week to afford to got to college.

my friends? didnt work... and didnt owe a cent when they graduated college.

i owed tens of thousands of dollars.

now tell me... who is getting the short end of the stick?

btw my other white male friend whose situation was the same as mine but he is 1 year older than me (im 35) is STILL paying on his student loans every month.

the only reason i am not is i cashed in my 401k years ago to help get rid of them and get some relief from the financial burden my student loans were putting on me.

Just because you're in a racial majority doesn't mean that you should not be represented politically or that you should be denied advocacy. If it's "fair" to have a representative organization for other ethnicities to lobby for their constituents, why should you be excluded just because you're in the majority?

i think eventually someone needs to point out the inequalities of being a white male.

i also think that the 'spirit' of some of these 'privileges' that has been set aside to help out has been lost.

[TIMMAAYY]

Originally Posted by Sparkles

You seriously believe that?

Apparently you've never heard of defamation. Words are a pretty big deal.

Only if you have a good attorney.

[EvilPepe]

Originally Posted by Declyn

in a way being male and white is like one of the worst things ever...

...i also think that the 'spirit' of some of these 'privileges' that has been set aside to help out has been lost.

I agree that the programs you are describing are probably not the best way to combat discrimination because it IS discrimination. The problem is that it focuses on symptoms of a problem rather than addressing the problem itself (namely educational shortfalls in K-12 in areas with a lower socio-economic level). This leads to people such as yourself being passed over and preferential treatment being given to someone else based on their race (though supporters of "affirmative action" programs would say it isn't ONLY based on race, but it seems to end up boiling down to the same thing). I think in the long term they might be beneficial, but do the means justify the ends?

But to say that it is "like one of the worst things ever" is a bit of an exaggeration, don't you think? Go to a library and see if they have a copy of "The Color of Fear" (documentary), and weigh the themes in that film versus having college loans to pay off. I'm not saying it will make any discrimination you or any of us in the "majority" face any easier, but it might provide some perspective.

[Cujo_64]

Originally Posted by Declyn

in a way being male and white is like one of the worst things ever... i could not get one red cent in the financial aid department when i was trying to go to college.

but a buddy of mine whose father had the same job as my dad and about the same years of service at work as my dad, and (his mom worked where mine did not) was able to get a full ride. he was 'mixed' father was black, mother was white.

i asked if his ride was grades based and he told me no his grades were border line at best. he totally agreed it was because he was listed as black on the application forms.

several of my other friends are american indian... they got full rides, although they had to go to either oklahoma or kansas to get it. according to them as long as you could prove you are 1/8th american indian they get free medical care, and free schooling.

none of my friends nor their families had been oppressed none of them came from poor families. we were all middle-ish class families.

all of us were about the same grade wise. yet i had to take out tons of loans, my dad took out loans, and i worked 30 hours a week to afford to got to college.

my friends? didnt work... and didnt owe a cent when they graduated college.

i owed tens of thousands of dollars.

now tell me... who is getting the short end of the stick?

btw my other white male friend whose situation was the same as mine but he is 1 year older than me (im 35) is STILL paying on his student loans every month.

the only reason i am not is i cashed in my 401k years ago to help get rid of them and get some relief from the financial burden my student loans were putting on me.



i think eventually someone needs to point out the inequalities of being a white male.

i also think that the 'spirit' of some of these 'privileges' that has been set aside to help out has been lost.

ya but you see... the blacks are owed this because our great great great great great great grand pappies was beatin them and makin em work da fields..... and the indians are owed this because our great great great great great great great great great great great great great great great grand pappies from overseas came over and took the indians land....




i actually heard this from a girl who worked at collin county college office in the student loan dept.... who was explaining the situation on why not every one is equal in this country now..... hooraay.



now....if we could only get back at those dinasaurs for trying to eat us long ago, the white man could have something to bitch about i guess ?

[Declyn]

Originally Posted by EvilPepe

But to say that it is "like one of the worst things ever" is a bit of an exaggeration, don't you think?

now that im older... a bit wiser yes i would say so.... i meant to say that was how i felt at the time i was going through it.

i grew up a military brat, so my entire life has been spent growing up with people of all races pretty much, so bigotry and all that was a foreign concept for me until i starting going to civilian schools after my dad retired.

so getting the shaft financial aid wise back then didnt change my perspective about the non-white races. it did make me mad at the system though.

but i can easily see where someone else in a similar situation could have developed some racial hatred.

i think the way a lot of these programs and situations are handled not only fuels racism but i think it creates it.

and it didnt just give me a big bill to pay after college, it left me behind. everyone left me behind as they went off to college because i could not get the money ahead of time and since they didnt have to worry about getting money they could go.

i stayed behind and worked 3 jobs and (had to have my dad remove me as a dependent tax wise) for 2 years to qualify for enough money to just cover my first semester of college.

i did the Juco thing for 2 years and after all of that i qualified to actually go to the college i wanted.

my parents didnt make enough money to have a college fund waiting for me plus they had 2 kids that needed to go.

anyway i think yall get my point. and yeah at the time i did think that being a white male was the worst thing ever.

and i say white male because my sister had ZERO issues getting financial aid. of course my dad was up to his ears (as well as me) in student loans at the time she applied lol.

[EvilPepe]

Originally Posted by Declyn

...it did make me mad at the system though...

but i can easily see where someone else in a similar situation could have developed some racial hatred.

i think the way a lot of these programs and situations are handled not only fuels racism but i think it creates it...

I think you are exactly right in regards to many of these programs. They foster resentment on all sides. A minority person might resent that they were given an unfair leg up and have to deal with people wondering if they "made the grade" because they are not a white male, and the white male resents that in this instance they can be put at an unfair advantage.

It seems to me to be a flawed system that was created with the best of intentions, but won't necessarily solve much. The problems run deeper. Many people who study these things now refer to "being racist" not as being prejudice, but as benefitting, intentionally or un-intentionally, from a system of unfair advantages and disadvantages.

And I understand where you are coming from with the college tuition stuff. I was lucky enough to get some academic scholorships to get me through tuition for ahwile, but I was basically "cut off" after my first semester. Having to work full time sucks when all your friends are sucking at the government FASFA teet and partying all the time. Now I'm trying to get some private loans because I am still ineligbile for federal aid.

[goalies-r-us]

Here's an interesting concept:

The Kalamazoo Promise

Local anonymous benefactors have pledged money for 100% tuition for four years to any public institute of higher learning (including vocational/community colleges in addition to universities) for ALL graduates+residents (must be both) of the local KPS public school system (which of course, Dom doesn't attend), regardless of gender, socio-economic status, and to a large extent, grades (I think you have to keep it above a D+ average).

Sadly, it took this offer to get the KPS system to decide that they needed to adjust their curriculum (and grade standards... no more "social promotion" to the next grade level even if Johnny can't read) so that all kids who graduated could be "college ready" at graduation. I'm sorry, shouldn't that have been a goal whether kids had free college waiting for them or not?

This is seen as a long-term economic fix for the area -- a well-trained and -educated workforce is helpful for attracting companies to the area.